Michael Brandt, CEO and founder of HVMN, delves into the world of exogenous ketones. Discover how ketones can optimize metabolism, enhance performance, and support brain health.
With topics ranging from the development of a pure ketone drink to its potential applications in traumatic brain injuries and cognitive function, this episode is a must-listen for anyone seeking to perform at their peak.
Episode HighlightsMy main job as CEO is not to decide things, but to decide who should decide things. – Michael Brandt Click To TweetYour brain is super greedy for ketones, it's like a sponge for ketones. – Michael Brandt Click To TweetMost nootropics are acaloric. They don't have calories inside of them. So it's like you're pulling the cord on your lawn mower. Like, you're revving it up, but, like, you still need the actual gas. You still need the energy to come… Click To Tweet
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About Michael Brandt
Michael Brandt delved into the world of ketones through various fasting methods, and endurance running. Recognizing the benefits of ketones in optimizing nutrition and performance, HVMN created a bioavailable ketone drink. In 2022, HVMN successfully launched the product commercially. Currently, the ketone drink is available nationwide in grocery stores and online. The Department of Defense saw the potential of ketones to enhance the physical and mental stamina of soldiers during challenging missions. So they awarded HVMN a $6M grant to study the therapeutic effects of ketones.
Top things you’ll learn from Michael Brandt
- The potential for ketones to help treat traumatic brain injuries and neurological diseases
- How ketones affect brain function and cognitive efficiency
- Exogenous ketones for performance optimization
- Ketone IQ, a pure ketone drink, is a revolutionary brain fuel that improves cognitive function and supports athletic performance
- It provides a direct source of ketones, a fourth macronutrient that can fuel various bodily processes like thinking, running, and recovery
- Exogenous ketones can be obtained through fasting or by using products like ketone esters, ketone salts, or 1,3 butanediol
- Benefits of ketones for brain health
- Ketones have shown promise in rescuing brain function in physically and cognitively demanding tasks, especially in high-altitude environments
- They can increase cognitive efficiency even in non-strenuous activities
- Ketones offer potential benefits in the treatment of traumatic brain injuries (TBI) and concussions by rescuing neuron metabolism and providing an alternative energy source for the brain
- Stacking nootropics and exogenous ketones
- Nootropics, substances believed to increase brain activity, can be stacked with ketones for enhanced cognitive performance
- Ketone IQ is a recommended addition to any psychoactive experience, as it fuels the brain with efficient energy
- Ketones, unlike traditional caffeine sources, can provide sustained and clean energy without spiking insulin levels
- H.V.M.N’s partnership with the Department of Defense
- H.V.M.N’s ketone drink caught the interest of the Department of Defense for physically and cognitively demanding missions
- Research studies with the DoD demonstrate the ability of ketones to rescue brain function in challenging environments
- Ketones show promise in improving the treatment of traumatic brain injuries (TBI) and concussions
- Product: H.V.M.N Ketone-IQ (save up to 30% with code URBAN)
- Book: Principles
- Podcast: Hard Ketones Alcohol Alternative
Nick Urban [00:00:05]:
Welcome to episode number 112 of the mind body peak performance with your host, Nick Urban. Today, we’re exploring a topic and a fascination of mine that is called exogenous ketones. And many experts are calling ketones a 4th fuel for the BHE, aside from the primary macronutrients of protein, of fats, and BHE, ketones have other use cases and benefits. They naturally increase 1 week fast, but then we can also use products such as ketone esters, ketone salts, or 13 butane dial to get some of these benefits without fasting or following a strict ketogenic diet. Joining us today is CEO and the founder of HVMN Health via Modern Nutrition, Michael Brandt. Michael is the cofounder and CEO of HBMN. He’s an avid triathlete, and he knows a thing or 2 about key tones. I first came across HVMN around 2017 when they released their very first ketone ester product, BHE it was extremely expensive, it tasted awful, and it was just out of reach for all BHE the highest level most competitive athletes. They’ve made some big strides recently, and launched a new product in 2022 that is the focus of this conversation and the research around ketones, and how they can improve your metabolism, which in essence is the system that helps your body convert the things you consume into cellular BHE energy. The show notes to this episode will be at mind body peak dotcom/112. And if you’d like to try ketone IQ, their product for yourself, the code BHE URBN will save you 10% on your order. Or you can take advantage of the special deal that Michael mentions in the show And if you find one in a local store near you, the first shot is on them. That’s right, completely risk free. And if you want more around exogenous ketone products, and the science, the benefits, all that stuff, I did record an episode a while back I believe it was number 43 with a man named Frank Yossa of hard ketones. You can give that one a listen too. Alright, sit back, relax, and enjoy this conversation with Michael Brandt of HVMN.
Nick Urban [00:02:46]:
Michael, welcome to Mindbody Peak Performance.
Michael Brandt [00:02:49]:
Nick’s so good to be here. We have a fun conversation today.
Nick Urban [00:02:52]:
Yeah. So I didn’t tell you this offline when we were talking a minute ago. BHE I actually took a half serving of your ketone IQ product about an hour ago. And 30 minutes in, I went to have lunch, and I actually wasn’t hungry. So that was the first effect I noticed from it. And I’m excited to dive into the world of exogenous ketone products today with you. But before we get started, tell me and our listeners something unusual or interesting about ketones.
Michael Brandt [00:03:25]:
One step that I love around ketones is that they’re one of the oldest forms of fuel. So our body has been making and using ketones for at least 300000 years. And in fact, ketones are very special for humans in particular. Humans are the only species of primate that have baby fat. And that baby fat goes into ketones to provide our infant brains with the energy that they need because humans have this large brains. So, like, he tells her this fundamentally human
Nick Urban [00:04:03]:
fuel source that have been part of human evolution for at least 300000 years. Give me some of your background. How did you get involved in the world of ketones?
Michael Brandt [00:04:11]:
I got involved in the world of ketones by being a curious explorer in BHE, doing things like intermittent fasting or extended fasting, then 7 day long fast, then 36 hour fast, on a regular basis. I got into endurance running as well, so I’m a sub elite marathoner. And a lot of what’s make or break in a marathon is your nutrition strategy in training and in performance. I’m running 60 plus miles a week. So a lot of performance comes down to nutrition optimization. And what I saw rewinding the clock, you know, 5 years is that everyone was trying to get their ketones up and jumping through all these hoops. So when you’re fasting, your ketones go up. Anytime your blood sugar is low, your body starts making ketones. when you’re fasting, when you’re doing a ketogenic, low carb diet, when you’re doing endurance sports, your ketones go up. And a lot of people like the way that it feels. They feel really dialed or they feel runners high. They feel really focused from ketones. And the insight that I had was, okay, why don’t we make a directly ingestible bioavailable ketone. Like, it’s just brain fuel. Feels really good. Why can’t you go to the store and buy a shot of ketones? And that was, like, this kinda simple yet complex question asked because it it took a number of years. When we came up with the initial proof of concept, we were the first ever to make a pure ketone drink at scale. We got a multimillion dollar contract with the Department of Defense, special operations command. They were very interested in a ketone drink for physically cognitively demanding missions, you know, at altitude, low oxygen environments, high stress, high strain environments, seeing how ketones can improve physical stamina, and even more importantly, mental efficiency, mental stamina. So things like target practice when you’re in a fatigued state is really interesting to the special operations community. And that was great BHE as a first customer, our product was very expensive at the time. I know, Nick, that you tried it back then. It was, you know, $30.33 dose. If you still have one of those, hold on to it. It’s a iPhone version 1, collector’s item. It was very expensive, very crazy tasting, but, you know, very effective proof of concept. And then from there, we rolled into better scale, tweak the formulation, made it more efficacious, and then got it to a spot where we were really happy to launch it to the commercial world in 2022, and that TBI about 16 months ago at this point. And it’s been great. We’re now in grocery stores nationwide where we have a booming direct to consumer BHE, continuing to do our work with the Department of Defense, and expanding into new exciting areas around, especially brain health, ketones around, you know, Alzheimer’s traumatic brain injury. We can go into some of those areas, but ketones started out as being really interesting for performance and longevity and or we’re understanding
Nick Urban [00:07:09]:
new application areas for this exciting technology too. Yeah. I actually had it on my list of things to ask you about the brain health and specifically BHE recovery, how ketone exogenous ketones can help with that. But that’s an important distinction to make. What do you view as the primary differences between your body producing ketones when in a low blood sugar, low insulin state versus using an exogenous product.
Michael Brandt [00:07:36]:
Yeah. That’s a great question. A good distinction to make, right, that your body can make ketones indogeneously whenever you’re low sugar. Your body has this mechanism to be able to make ketones BHE your brain first and foremost needs it when you’re low blood sugar, Your body can’t use fat in your brain. Brain fat does not cross the blood brain barrier, but ketones do. So ketones are really this super fuel for your brain when they’re present. Your brain is super greedy for ketones. It’s like a sponge for ketones. And endogenous ketosis is you are burning fat and you’re turning into ketones. Exogenous ketones, like, what we have with ketone IQ is a pure form of of ketone that once your body digested, it becomes the same beta hydroxybutyrate, in your blood, the same ketone body in your blood. ketones can be used by all source of muscle. You can be used by skeletal muscles, cardiac muscles, neurons and, again, especially neurons in the brain are really pref they really prefer ketones as a fuel source. it’s the same ketone at the end of the day. The difference is is it coming from your body burning fat, or is it coming from an outside source? And there’s a lot in the middle as well BHE you can be, like, doing a keto diet or fasting, and then also drink ketone IQ, and then your body is at the same time burning, fat, and you have added ketones on top. A lot of people find key turn on queue to be helpful like what you said right before when we were chatting. It’s like when we when you when you drinks KeyTRAN IQ has this kinda appetite control effect. A lot of people report it helps them, like, extend their fast. It helps people, like, not have as much hunger cravings. And so it can help kinda jump start the process into doing a low carb diet if that’s what people are interested in. So they’re different sources of ketones endogenous versus exogenous. At the end of the day, it produces the same ketone molecule in your bloodstream
Nick Urban [00:09:33]:
and has some overlapping BHE, but, you know, some difference there as well. Yeah. And they seem to complement each other nicely. If you’re already producing ketones in the body, taking a little BHE. Maybe it’s half a serving. Maybe it’s a full serving. Maybe it’s two servings in some cases that can amplify the effects and change make things that are usually difficult easier. You mentioned earlier beta, hydroxybuterate, BHP. What are the main different types of ketones?
Michael Brandt [00:10:01]:
Yeah. So there’s a couple others that like, there’s 3 ketone buys. BHP is the main one, beta hydroxybutyrate. There’s acetone and there’s acetoacetate that your body basically, like, transfers them through these 3 states. BHE the one that is, like, actually used for cellular metabolism, the one that’s actually turning to ATP is BHP. So the other ones are, like, kind of component intermediary steps of the process that your body is, like, transferring it through, but, like, the direct one that you would want in your system is BHE. So when you’re fasting, you’re creating BHB when you’re when you’re doing a blood ketone test, you’re testing for BHB. So you can think of the other ones as, like, like, supporting actors or, like, they’re they’re parts of the overall, like, ketone system in your BHE. But if you’re getting BHE. That’s really, like, the main one, and then your body will, like, shift that into the other ones to keep the balance that’s needed. And to underscore what you said a minute ago, if you’re following a low carb ketogenic diet or you’re fasting, this can increase the effects of that. But at the same time, there’s no dietary requirement.
Nick Urban [00:11:12]:
Are there any downsides of, say, having a higher-carb meal and then using ketone IQ?
Michael Brandt [00:11:18]:
that’s a really good point that we’re not pushing a keto diet specifically. You don’t have to do a keto diet in order to drink a ketone IQ and get you know, it’s 10 grams of pure ketone dial, and you’re gonna get that on top of your fueling, whatever else you’re eating, irrespective of what else whatever else you’re eating. It’s kinda like if you have 10 grams of protein powder after a meal. It’s like it kind of doesn’t matter what your meal I put an asterisk, like, it don’t wanna have, like, a doughnut and a Coca Cola, and then have some protein powder, have some ketone IQ. Like, there there will be maybe some differences in how you’re digestive system is prime to digest it. But, like, generally, if you’re having 10 grams of protein powder after BHE versus after a salad, 10 grams of protein is 10 grams of protein is 10 grams of protein, and same with ketones. We see a lot of our elite athlete partners, our special forces partners, they stack. So the whole cool thing about ketones is they go through a different set of enzymes to turn into cellular energy. So the most importantly, they’re not mediated by insulin. So glucose, when you have something with carbohydrate in it, your blood glucose goes up, blood sugar, and then your body releases insulin to address that blood glucose, ketones don’t require insulin. So they don’t spike insulin. They are non insulin andgenic, which BHE the way is part of why what makes it such a healthy fuel source is that, like, if we’re slamming sugar all day and we’re constantly spiking our insulin, you eventually develop insulin resistance, which is Lisa Type 2 BHE, not good. So the fact that ketones are a non insulin spiking fuel source is what’s caught wind of a lot of folks in the longevity community where it’s this is very efficient. Like, you’re not creating oxidative stress. You’re not spiking your insulin, but you’re still getting, like, a nice pick me up off of it. And so ketones as a fuel go through a different pathway than glucose. And so for athletes so some the reason our elite athletes will actually like to stack both is because they don’t compete with each other. It’s like your Prius. You have, like, gas and you have electricity, and you’re able to tap into both. So it really depends what the use case is. Right? If you’re trying to go, like, low carb, if you’re trying to go for max you know, reduction of metabolic stress, then you people tend to go, like, lower carb, lower sugar, more ketones in their diet, people are trying to go for, like, max athletic performance, then they’ll dual fuel. I still recommend I’m a BHE endurance athlete and BHE marathoner. I still when I eat stuff with carbohydrates, I try to go for lower glycemic index, like slower carbs. I will have carbs and ketones, but I’m I’m trying to avoid that, like, fundamental, like, spike of blood blood glucose. Like, that’s not good for anyone even if you are, like, doing glycolytic training. Like, you don’t you still don’t there’s no reason that you should be, like, slamming a lot of sugar. You can have, like, oatmeal or something that’s fibrous that will, like, replete your glycogen stores over time without
Nick Urban [00:14:26]:
causing that spike, which is what you really wanna avoid. And even if you are competing at a high level and you’re doing a long endurance event and you want that extra that extra fuel, to really dual fuel and have the carbohydrates on board instead of using some of the the goos and the gels, I found that honey, the data around that, and the hypoglycemia that accompanies after insulin brings the blood sugar back down is much less from than maltodextrin and some of the other things that you find commonly in those products.
Michael Brandt [00:14:59]:
Yeah. That’s interesting how honey is kind of stood apart from other other sources of sugar in the keto community or carnivore community. and a paleo community where I think that the science is interesting there where it does seem to be, like, better source of sugar than others. I mean, it’s also got antioxidants. It’s got, like, other characteristics from the fact that it’s coming from nature. It’s not just like pure moleto dextrin or whatever. So, yeah, we like honey.
Nick Urban [00:15:32]:
You’ve already touched on a number of different benefits. from the cognition to the athletic performance, what are some of the use cases you see common with this? And
Michael Brandt [00:15:45]:
Also, anything that you’ve found that has as well studied that ketones support. Yeah. A lot of where people like to use ketones is when they’re in a, like, cognitively demanding situation. So one of the areas that we’ve looked at a lot with the DOD is we have our participants, operators, like, doing a ruck So wearing weight, climbing at altitude on an incline. And so it simulated 20,000 feet of altitude and they’re on an incline. So you expect some decrement in physical stamina and in cognitive efficiency just due to the hypoxic environment there, low oxygen environment, When you have key talents, you’re able to significantly rescue brain function. And that’s really exciting. So BHE cognitive efficiency on target practice. And so then that carries over into other areas where, like, if if you just at your desk at sea level, not, like, carrying a 20, forty pound backpack, you still are able to see that increase in cognitive efficiency. Just in general, when you’re dealing with activities, you have a lot going on, a lot of neurons firing, you’re able to just, like, stretch for longer. And then a lot of why we’re seeing people really enjoy it in the athletic context is, again, mediated by the brain. So you’re probably familiar with and probably a lot of your listeners are familiar with this idea of the central governor It’s this yeah. Populizing this book by Alex Hutchinson called Indoor. Initially, it was created by this site by Tim Noakes, who is actually a very early, like, keto diet person. This idea, the central governor, which is that usually when you BHE, usually when you hit some limit athletically, it’s not your actual legs giving up on you. It’s your mind no longer having enough willpower left. to tell your legs to shut up and go. And what we’re seeing with ketones is that because of the way that our brain really prefers ketones as a fuel source that when you have ketones present, your brain is able to just, like, keep it ticking for longer and able to be, like, this central governor of your entire nervous system. And when your brain senses that there is more nutrient availability because there’s ketones available that you are able to prolong your effort across the rest of your body HVMN with all other things being equal, even if your legs are just as fatigued, even if you’re, you know, twenty miles into the race, Like, all other things being equal when you have ketones present, there’s more of a central governor effect on how you’re able to run faster or longer at that at that stage. So the athletic and physical side as well as the It’s like mental side people, you know, at their desk are doing research. The unifying factor there is all around the brain and the fact that ketones are brain fuel. So that all is really interesting. That all is, like, pretty well established. As far as what we’re looking out ahead to, it’s that we recently got Greenlet for a study with the Navy, the Naval Health Research Center looking at TBI. So there’s been a number of studies around TBI’s traumatic brain injury, concussions, BHE been a number of studies around, like, ketogenic diet, MCT oil powder. MCT is a form simple form of fat that easily converts into ketones. You know, not with ketone IQ, we have a more direct bioavailable form of ketone. But then there’s been studies done that show, hey. When you induce your body to make make its own ketones that you can rescue brain activity after impact. And we’re so we’re doubling down into that with Q1 IQ, seeing what’s possible there. And that’s really exciting area. BHE, basically, when you have a concussion, there’s damage done at the moment of impact, and then there’s this swelling, there’s hypometabolism of glucose that occurs afterwards. Basically, your neurons starve for 72 plus hours after the impact. And if you’re able to rescue neuron metabolism with ketones because, again, they go through this other pathway. They don’t require insulin. They don’t require is much oxygen to turn into ATP. They’re just they offer a different substrate that can rescue some amount of energy demand in the brain after impact. it’s the same mechanism of action of, like, hey. Why does it why do I feel a little bit more sharp on a run, or why do I feel a little bit more sharp when I met my BHE. Like, that same mechanism of action of how ketones work in the brain also has some promise for how key ketones can maybe help with TBI and concussions and other neurological diseases and injuries.
Nick Urban [00:20:24]:
Yeah. That was one thing that really caught my attention when I was researching TBI in concussion because I played collegiate BHE And Rugby, and those sports are very conducive to TBI. And I came across ketone esters back then, and they are quite expensive. But at the same time, I recognize that the brain has impaired glucose BHE. So then you’re looking into other ways of improving that and getting alternative fuels to it, ketones came across my radar. And I didn’t get the chance to try it firsthand post concussion or give it to my friends who had concussions. but it seems like it’s a really cool novel approach, and I believe there’s now research that’s actually examining this. Yeah. It’s a really exciting area. I think that when you can help someone
Michael Brandt [00:21:13]:
run a faster marathon or, you know, be more sharp at work, that’s cool. But I think for people that have actual neurological impairment, and you can return them to baseline functioning. I think there is a more urgent need and a more meaningful problem to solve inside of that. And it’s interesting too BHE, like, you can look at TBI also Biohacking at Alzheimer’s, which is different neurological impairment, but there’s also hypometabolism in the brain as Alzheimer’s takes hold. And, again, it like, you have this reduction of glucose metabolism. If you can provide another BHE, then you can potentially rescue brain energy. And that’s really exciting that we can help, like, again, like, not just help, you know, only healthy people run faster marathons, but that we can make a dent in expanding health span in general. I think that’s what it’s like really exciting to me. I think that the I think it’s all exciting. It’s like, I think you’re having a the mission is help BHE billion people all live their best lives. But I think it’s inspiring when you can help someone, like, get back to basics in their everyday life. And I think that there’s a lot of people that can potentially affect. Right? Like, we all if we’re so lucky, where we all become older, and we all have some, you know, decrement in our physical and cognitive BHE. And if we’re able to extend by 5, 10 years the health span of the average adult, like, that’s a massive impact on all sorts of happiness, overall economic output. Like, there’s a lot of ways that that moves the needle for just big global outcome.
Nick Urban [00:22:59]:
Yeah. And the central governor theory that you were mentioning earlier is interesting because it’s just one mechanism in one way that we see the body and the mind influencing each other. And there’s not as much that directly influences the brain, which then influences the rest of the BHE. A lot of times, it’s, like, through Vegas nerves signaling where you’re impacting the brain indirectly and 10 the things that you use that increase or penetrate the blood ring barrier and exert effects oftentimes have some significant side effects and aren’t, like, nutritionally as needed as ketones are to, like, as a cleaner burning fuel than glucose. Yeah. A lot of times, it’s drugs.
Michael Brandt [00:23:39]:
Right? It is like caffeine or stimulance or hormones that it’s interesting BHE those tend to be very, like, targeted. Right? Even just looking at caffeine, it’s it’s a very targeted drug. that, you know, blocks adenosine, your sleep hormone, and, like, definitely has an effect, but it also it’s very specific. When you think about you can think about, like, a hierarchy of needs in your overall body and what you need for homeostasis and, like, at the top of the pyramid is is like water. Right? Like, if you’re tired and you’re dehydrated, TBI the end of the day, if you drink some water, your body’s gonna have a more restful sleep cycle. If it’s 11 AM and you are tired and you’re dehydrated and you drink some water, your body’s gonna have a better energy rise throughout the rest of the day. So, like, How does this water, you know, make you make it better for you to sleep and how does it make you more active during the day? Well, it’s that it’s just so high up the pyramid that whatever your body is doing, it’s it requires that. So the we like the things that are higher up the pyramid. Right? Like, protein, very high up the pyramid where, you know, if you’re weightlifter, body builder, cool. It’s gonna help if you’re seventy five years old and you’re dealing with muscle loss from old age, protein is gonna help. Like, anything that you’re doing, like, any kind of movement we’re all moving, protein helps with that. And so ketones are Similarly, like, they’re a macronutrient. Right? They contain calories. They’re really interesting BHE you got fat, carbs, proteins is the 3 canonical macronutrients, and ketones are a 4th macronutrient, and they’re able to help your body with all sorts of processes from thinking to running, to recovery, to like, the word that I like is the considering it as an adaptive fuel so to where whatever your body is trying to do in the moment that ketones can help to fuel that versus, yeah, when you look at something like a drug, it’s so much lower down on that pyramid where, like, okay, a drug when it’s engineered well does a very specific thing really efficiently, but it’s not portable to, like, other processes and other endpoints that you have in your body. So it’s not to, like, say they are not helpful. Like, there’s a lot of amazing things in modern medicine where, like, very targeted drugs have. The difference is, you know, we’re talking about an adaptive fuel that can help on a lot of different things versus a drug is something that’s, like, very specifically targeted towards a really specific endpoint
Nick Urban [00:26:06]:
Yeah. It’s an adaptive fuel and a nutrient And even the most targeted of drugs have some downstream consequences that we may or may not know yet. So it
Michael Brandt [00:26:16]:
it’s different than taking a nutrient, which the body expects and requires to function. Yeah. Your body knows exactly what to do with it. Like, you have the DNA. Like, we were saying at the top of the call, like, for 300000 years. Like, we’ve been making and using ketones in our body. So, like, we we have all of the component pieces to utilize it, like, all over our body.
Nick Urban [00:26:35]:
Yeah. And it’s becoming we now have lower levels on average that I’d have to imagine given the ubiquitous nature of food and grocery stores and late night snacks. And we no longer have the low insulin state for most of us who aren’t following a low carb diet consistently and time restricted eating that a an an exogenous product like this becomes much more helpful. Yeah. It’s interesting where ancient humans had higher ketone levels.
Michael Brandt [00:27:03]:
It just we did not have the context where there was wide availability of processed BHE. Like, everything you’ve seen in the convenience store is generally not good for you. You’ve heard that advice. I’m sure, like, at the grocery store, like, just stick to the perimeter? Like, all the stuff in the middle is just what is a what is a lucky charm exactly? Like, what why am I eating this? Like, what is in these bottles of mayonnaise? Like, what what is this stuff? The stuff on the perimeter is real food and generally the cheap mass produced stuff is is processed BHE, and that just isn’t great for you. It spikes your blood sugar. It interferes a lot of hormones, and it didn’t exist in an evolutionary context. And so evolutionarily, like, I I don’t think that ancient humans were, like, strict keto. I think BHE Paleo is pretty close to what there’s no skittles on the savannah. Right? Like, there is no abundance of processed carbohydrates. There’s probably, you know, some grains and some berries So there was some carbohydrates in the context where it was a small amount, and they it just wasn’t this highly processed stuff. And so ancient humans moving around a lot more. Right? Like, endurance hunting, moving around 6, 7, 8 miles a day, not having a ton of carbs to begin with. So, like, going in and out of ketosis on a ongoing basis for sure. And I think people should get back to that way of being through everything. Like, not I don’t I don’t think just drinking ketone IQ is just like panacea if you have a unhealthy lifestyle. Otherwise, I think we all need to move around more. I think we need to eat less processed sugar. And is I think if ketone IQ is, like, a tool in the toolkit, and it’s cool because it’s this, like, modern take on this ancient fuel source. So it’s, like, think we could do a lot to learn from the patterns of what generations have used before us for sure. I wanna hear more about what you’re doing with
Nick Urban [00:29:01]:
the DOD and the grant you got, the $6,000,000 grant. Before we do, you’ve mentioned caffeine. And every quarter, I will do a week or 2 break from caffeine in any form of stimulants just to let my adenosine receptors reset. And so that when I come back, I actually feel everything I ingest would ketones using an exogenous ketone supplement help the process
Michael Brandt [00:29:27]:
of weaning off caffeine. Yeah. That’s something that actually, my cofounder is doing this right now. He’s weaning off of caffeine doing a a just ritual, like, decaffeinization, which I highly recommend. yeah, I think it’s really good to reset. I think it’s incredible, like, how much sensitivity you can regain. Like, I’m sure after 2 weeks. Right? you have a cup of coffee and you just feel — Oh, yeah. — you feel it all the way again. So I I think it’s really smart that you’re doing that. Definitely recommend it. And, yeah, my cofounder Jeff’s doing in the process of it right now. ketone IQ helps a lot with that because, like, it’s not like a one to one. It’s not like doing exactly what caffeine does. BHE as far as keeping you alert and clear headed, Kevin does have this, like, super in a way, it’s very, like, rough. Like, it it it’s very jarring to the system. It makes you, like, hyper alert. It, like, quickens your heart rate. releases adrenaline. Like, it’s a very, like it’s very much a stimulant. It’s very much an upper. ketone IQ doesn’t do quite that, However, it provides this, like, clarity and awareness. It feels like you got up from, like, a fresh nap. So I I don’t think it’s like a one to one replacement, but it is one of those things that can help. A lot of people use it also the topic of caffeine replacement, a lot of people use it for, like, is instead of their second coffee of the day, especially because, like, you have a coffee in the morning. A lot of people I know, like, don’t wanna have caffeine after noon. Like, I don’t I have I personally have one cup of coffee a day unless I’m doing caffeine fast, like, what you’re saying. The other thing just kind of fun, like, I don’t I don’t we don’t sell any product here, but, like, the other one that people like here talking about when they’re weaning off a caffeine is nicotine, like nicotine lozenges or gum. Again, not exactly the same as caffeine, but, like, have you experienced that? Like, it’s like it can be a little bit of an upper and it’s just different pathway from caffeine.
Nick Urban [00:31:24]:
Yeah. I use nicotine on occasion. I’m actually looking for nicotine patches that are much lower dose BHE right now, the lowest I can find is 7 milligrams, which is a hefty dose for a non user. So I’m looking into, like, if I can cut them in half or a quarter because then you get a nice slow bleed of nicotine into the system. And as what my neuroscience professor says, that’s the most underrated study drug and neutropic out there. So if I can find a low dose nicotine patch that slowly delivers nicotine, without any of the other crap, I will be very excited.
Michael Brandt [00:31:58]:
I love it. Yeah. There’s a product idea right there. Yeah. If you if you’re not coming off of, like, hardcore smoking nicotine addict, which is mainly where those are addressed to. I think that’s a clever idea. Like, 7 days a lot if you’re not used to if you’re not actual, like, recovering smoker.
Nick Urban [00:32:15]:
One thing I was wondering about and I haven’t heard anyone else talk about, but I did it this morning, and that is to combine ketones with nootropics. I find that I’m guessing like caffeine adding ketones to it, make it like rocket fuel. It becomes way stronger, and at the same time, it becomes smoother and clearer than I expected. I use a company called Nutopia this morning and their Nectar X product. And I’m blown away how much stronger it feels, but in a good way, after combining it with, so far, only half of a dose of ketone IQ. Yeah. It’s it’s cool how they stack. Right? Because
Michael Brandt [00:32:54]:
these nootropics, like, neutopia. I haven’t seen them in I I personally use it, but just looking at their ingredients. good stack there. And in general, nootropics BHE activity. Right? Like, they’re they’re triggering some firing of neurons in a pattern that wouldn’t otherwise happen if if you didn’t have the neutropic. It’s creating an increase in brain activity which creates an increase in brain energy demand. And, like, where is that energy coming from? And that’s where ketones are really interesting as stack on top of it where we don’t really consider it a BHE, but it it works really well with nootropics because whether you’re having I think, the stack that you’re having or, you know, microdosing with psilocybin or having caffeine or whatnot that you’re creating some increase in brain activity. But, again, like, most nootropics are a caloric. They don’t have calories inside of them. So it’s like you’re pulling the cord on your lawn mower. Like, you’re revving it up, but, like, you still need the actual gas. You still need energy to come from somewhere. And that’s why, you know, Starbucks will have like, 45 grams of sugar in their coffee because, like, yeah, you’re getting steamed up from caffeine. And then, okay, we’re also gonna load you with for the fuel, we’re gonna load you up with sugar. I think that’s a less good stack. I mean, you’re obviously familiar with a lot a lot of people are with, like, bulletproof coffee, right, where You have caffeine. And then inside of the coffee, there’s also butter or MCT. MCT being medium chain triglyceride, simple form of fat that your body can relatively easy turn easily turn into ketones. Reason BHE coffee was so successful is that same one, 2 punch of okay. You have, like, this neutropic effect from the caffeine and maybe there’s other neutropics inside of there, and then you have the actual fuel from the MCT. What we’ve done is just innovated on top of that, which is, okay, BHE was cool. Now with ketone IQ, you just have a pure ketone dial, and that’s able to provide you direct ketones way more efficiently than than MCT could, which requires, like, some conversion and some lossiness in in order to turn into to ketones. So it’s a nice stack there in general. I I say, like, you know, a lot of the a lot of times when people go on, like, deeper plant medicine journeys, they try to fast and purge their system, get into, like, a fastest ketotic state. So the brain is maybe so the brain is mainly fueling on ketones. And so I would say, yeah, ketones are really nice as a, like, kind of multiplier on top of any kind of psychoactive
Nick Urban [00:35:29]:
or BHE type of compound that you’re playing around with? I haven’t shared this before, but I actually make what I call an upgrade version of bulletproof coffee And that is I’ll use a clean organic c 8 MCT oil, and then I will combine that with instead of butter, I’ll use cacao butter, which is a really rich source of ferric acid, and ferric acid is hard to find in a diet, but it has all kinds of other incredible health benefits. And I don’t remember off the top of my head, but I know there’s a diet called I think it’s the croissant diet. where the author talks all about how this one magical compound, ferric acid, is the reason that he was able to lose so much weight and have all these other health transforming effects. and cow butter is the richest source, plus it tastes great. Yeah. See, that’s interesting. I think I think that what you’re saying there with your, like, special stack, I feel like That’s actually a really interesting insight where, like, I bet a lot of people listening in have their own stack. It’s it’s an interesting
Michael Brandt [00:36:28]:
like, moment in the day of, like, your witch’s brew or whatever you wanna call it, like, of what have you put into that blender bottle that works for you, like, oh, I like, you know, I like Rachie Mushrooms or I like a little bit of new Right? Like, like, people I think are innovating around that. I think there’s it’s a really interesting, like, entry point into people’s lives And I think about that a lot with Keaton IQ. Like, I think we’re doing our job if we were, like, part of people’s, like, which is brew.
Nick Urban [00:37:02]:
Well, since you’ve brought up which is brews, I have to know now what is in your which is brew that you do in the morning for your health performance and bioharmony.
Michael Brandt [00:37:12]:
Yes. I’ve been experimenting with with a few different ones from now. So I’ve been I generally like what’s inside of athletic greens. I think they have a good, just like starter stack. I think there’s some modifications you can make off that, but I think that’s a Good start. I’ve been adding I also so I like lemon water. I think lemon good to get the metabolism going. I think there’s some interesting effects it has on blood pH as well. It makes even though counterintuitive, lemon has acid in it the way it’s digested, it makes your blood a little bit more basic. I’ve BHE, like, in creatine also not as, like, a major BHE builder, not for, like, athletic performance, but actually, like, the brain effects of creatine are super interesting. I think creatine’s having, like, a second win revival as a as a, like, brain boost BHE the way that it helps your muscles, I think, is well understood, like, the as a pre workout effect, but that similarly in your BHE, it helps you to feel more sharps. I like that. I will have ketone IQ, of course, and then I stack in this is, like, real foods. Right? I’ll put, like, spinach, almonds, whole milk, I’ll put this all together into a blender. Actually, I have my which is BHE right here. Like, I’ll just I’ll blend it all up first thing in the morning and and sip on it, and or you should actually take my key to my queue as a, like, side shot and then I’ll have omega threes as well. I have, like, omega d omega 3 and d BHE stack. I think those are 2 of the most well researched supplements out there for, like, brain health and mood. I try to get sunlight as well every day, but, like, just in case I I have a vitamin d supplement. omega 3, really good for brain and body health. I’m definitely curious about different types of mushrooms that there are out there. And, like, in small amounts, like microdoses, to see what’s possible. I do think that I don’t know. I BHE, like, personally subjectively have been enjoying different yeah. Just playing around with mud water and some other things in that space and microdosing around and seeing what works for cognitive effect. And with some of those some of those I try to, like, not do every single day BHE it’s, like, kinda what you’re saying what we’re saying earlier with caffeine, but in, like, a even smaller time window of, like like, one day on, one day off or 2 days on, one day off to so it’s not to, like, blunt the overall effect.
Nick Urban [00:39:43]:
It’s funny you mentioned creatine as a nootropic. That was actually one of the very first articles ever wrote years ago, was on creatine, but not for sports performance, but as a nootropic
Michael Brandt [00:39:54]:
cognitive enhancer. Oh, man. I love that.
Nick Urban [00:39:57]:
Yeah. And then what form you said omega 3 are taking that in some form. Are you taking it in fish oil, krill oil, plant based, like algae based?
Michael Brandt [00:40:05]:
I have been taking it fish based. Within omega threesers, DHA and EPA, and, like, the DHA form, especially is good for brain health. I haven’t been really opinionated about, like, where it comes from. Like, I know that this form is, like, fish. I haven’t been really opinion on, like, doesn’t need to come from fish versus krill versus algae. I’m curious, do you have any thoughts? So I may I mainly have looked at, like, the molecular makeup of it of, like, hey. Does the DHA to EPA ratio? Like, is that legitimate? Is it, like, verifiably pure.
Nick Urban [00:40:44]:
Did you have thoughts on, like, sourcing there? That whole world is so confusing. I’ve heard, like, the scientists in the space say that it really doesn’t matter. I’ve also heard that there’s a bunch of different forms of fish oil, and there’s the ethyl ester form. There’s a triglyceride form. There’s BHE fish oil, and they all absorb differently. I like the triglyceride form and the phospholipid, and you get phospholipids and krill oil, and you also get astaxanthin small amounts, which stabilize the fish oil. So I’m not sure if it’s as essential. you also see lower amounts of EPA and DHA on the BHE. But since it’s in a phospholipid form, I’m not sure if you actually absorb any less than you would if the dose was three times higher on a typical fish oil. BHE so — Oh, nice. — as long as you’re getting some form, I don’t think it matters all that much. But your advice would be to go for the phospholipid form. Yeah. I like Crola Oil. I recently started using a different product. I’m not even sure what form it’s BHE, but Crola Oil is a is a decent one. You also can get some astaxanthin, which has its own benefits. And speaking speaking of, I know with Nootropics, a lot of times, fats can increase the absorption and enhance the effects Are there any co factors or signaling molecules or anything that you like to take alongside ketone IQ to boost
Michael Brandt [00:42:04]:
either the physical or mental or performance on both fronts? I would say nothing outside of what I’ve mentioned just as far as, like, the few a few of the what I mentioned it, like, has mental effects. And I think that’s what’s really interesting to me is, like, I think about it as, okay, what’s gonna, like, stimulate brain activity for me and then anything there, like, I will stat ketone IQ on top of. So I like cat a little bit of caffeine. I like experimenting with different types of functional mushrooms. To me, it’s about, like, what is gonna really get me into, like, that mental flow state where I feel, like, fresh and I’m not crashing and, you know, words are coming really easily to me. And so I’m always thinking about it from, like, very specifically mental brain lens? Like, what can I stack there that’s gonna make me feel alert
Nick Urban [00:42:56]:
throughout the day? One thing I was thinking of just now during our conversation is if ketones have a muscle sparing or other hormonal effects. Do they impact the hormonal system at all?
Michael Brandt [00:43:08]:
Yeah. So they have a a couple of interesting effects on the muscles. Right? They have a glycogen sparing effect. So glycogen is stored glucose. So when you’re exercising, your body is mainly burning glycogen using that for energy. When you have ketones present, you spare that glycogen. So that’s part of why it helps with the endurance effect in addition to all the central governor stuff. we’re talking about. They also help with muscle protein resynthesis. So after workout, if you have ketones in your system, then it helps you to rebuild that muscle more quickly so you can, like, you know, recover and do it again the next day. And we have something interesting on it seems like they’re able to increase EPO
Nick Urban [00:43:56]:
Michael Brandt [00:44:55]:
Yeah. With the DOD, we got this contract in 2019 for $6,000,000 to research 7 different BHE around exogenous ketones in different context And it’s been really exciting. It’s been a highlight of my career to work with some of these incredible people. Like, just some absolutely incredible humans and really just, like, admirable tough people that are that are, you know, defending the country and being able to, like, visit and BHE able to to be part of helping helping folks be, you know, healthier and better performing. So there’s these 7 different subtasks. They they relate to you know, some are more like, basic science, like looking at under a microscope, what does it do and versus some are more out in the field. Like, okay. How does this work when you have moving parts and you’re in, you know, something more quote unquote ecological, like a more realistic type of environment. So One of the areas in particular that is interesting for special operations command is hypoxia, so low oxygen environments. because that happens when you’re at altitude. It can also happen when you’re in airplane or spaceship. It can happen when you’re underwater. So there’s there’s many context where you can be hypoxic. You also can be hypoxic. It’s at the end of a large effort. So, like, at the end of a marathon when you’re, like, when you’ve been respirating heavily and you’ve maybe not been getting quite enough oxygen, you become hypoxic. So, like, hypoxia happens at altitude right away, but it can also happen into these other circumstances. And we showed that there’s a drug called Dynamox, which is the standard of care for when you have altitude sickness. And, basically, what it does is it makes you really sleepy. It, like, cures altitude sickness. You’re not, like, vomiting and dizzy, but you kinda just get tired. So it, like, solves one problem with, like, a less good problem. It’s still not awesome for a operator context. and ketones outperform that. So that’s already interesting. Okay. We’ve leapfrogged the standard of care there. And That’s interesting. So that’s all wrapping up, like, very soon here that that contract is several years long and it’s winding up to the BHE. But what’s what’s always promising makes exciting to see is, like, when you wind up a research project, there’s always, like, 5 new questions that you have out of it. And so we’re now chasing down some of those. So BHE one of the areas that we’re expanding into is with the HVMN, Navy Health Research Center Biohacking at TBI and concussions. So, basically, like, extending on, hey. Why does it why do we think that this works in these context for performance? Okay. If it works in that context for performance, if it’s you know, brain fuel that’s helping when you’re in a low oxygen state? What about if you’re in a low metabolism state after a concussion? Can ketones help there? Oh, what about this other research show that ketogenic diet was helpful there. So, like, just piecing together, and then also there’s the idea of just, like, veteran care. Like, when people leave the services a lot of times, you know, if you had TBI, it’s harder to think clearly, it’s harder to reenter the workforce. that makes it less appealing for people to go into that line of work to begin with. So if we can help improve quality of life for people coming out of the special forces or armed forces in general, that’s really interesting. And then that starts having interesting applications into, like, BHE well, you’re saying earlier, like, football rugby, like, getting some dings on the head. Yeah. And I think TBI
Nick Urban [00:48:34]:
BHE, they’re a major topic and concern among the military and among athletes. But even in the general population, they’re way more common than most people realize. And then on the other side, you mentioned hypoxia several times in this conversation, and I recently watched a program on TV about these climbers doing insane climbs,
Nick Urban [00:48:57]:
Nick Urban [00:48:59]:
feet, and of course, hypoxia is a major issue for them because they’re ice climbing. And I was thinking myself, I wonder if they’re even taking, like, a supplement stack to help the like, offset some of the hypoxic effects. because there’s certain adaptogens. I think Rodeola is one of them. And ketones are one they could use. It’d be interesting to see the performance change or, like, the safety change of pre and post designing a smart supplement stock.
Michael Brandt [00:49:30]:
Yeah. Yeah. Like, we’d love to talk to any rock climbers, advanced mountaineers, that you know. I think it’s really exciting participant group, and I think that, yeah, if you can improve quality of decision making, like, a lot of times it’s life and death for those guys. So, yeah, we’d love to we’d love to talk to those guys. Those are the kinds of missions that we are working on with special forces, like BHE It’s not, you know, just for for funsies, like, climbing a mountain at 28,000 feet, but it is, like, you know, being able to operate with efficiency at that kind of altitude. So Dan only keen to connect if anyone listening in is a high altitude mountaineer. Like, let’s talk or if you know if you know folks, Nick. Happy to happy to chat. Are there any other extreme conditions in which
Nick Urban [00:50:16]:
ketones can help on? We’ve already covered endurance, the long bouts of sustained physical activity and extreme altitudes.
Michael Brandt [00:50:24]:
Anything else? Yeah. We’re actually kicking something off with the European Space Agency because when you’re in space, you’re exposed to radiation. You’re you’re you get more solar raised radiation. Just general, like, galactic cosmic radiation. You have less atmosphere to protect you. And ketones create less oxidative stress in general. So radiation creates oxidative stress. So to, like, counteract that, if you have ketones for fuel, you’re creating less oxidative stress from the process of metabolism and of those ketones. So it’s an interesting way to address that. That’s probably the most out there one that, like, hey. As we’re going to Mars, you should be having, like, as low Oxy, stress diet as possible. It also carries over to to a degree with just, like, regular air travel. When you are at altitude, you are exposed to more radiation so I know a lot of people who just, you know, fast while flying, don’t eat while flying, drink ketone on cue while flying. It seems like for whatever reason, a lot of peep I I mean, I think the dots connect you. Like, a lot of people tell me, like, they really like Keytoiki when they’re flying. in particular. And I think it connects to everything that we’re saying here. Like, it, like, it does not know exactly why do you always feel kind of gross after a flight that you don’t feel awesome.
Nick Urban [00:51:50]:
BHE it seems like ketone IQ helps a lot of people when they’re doing air travel. That’s actually the most consistent way I’ve used ketone products over the years. is I’ll take some before I go along with selective antioxidants like molecular hydrogen and other things to buffer some of the free radicals, the reactive oxygen species, glutathione, like, that kind of thing. And I find that I adapt to the new locale, the time zone, and just bounce back from flying much faster when I do that. And since you’re also going through the millimeter wave and your very high altitude in the plane and everything, it seems like it’s just one of those things that makes sense And if you’re gonna be getting back in a day of recovery from your vacation by doing couple things right, to me, it’s a no brainer. love it. Yeah. I think it’s a good way to think about the
Michael Brandt [00:52:37]:
what you’re putting your body through when you fly is is nontrivial. I think it feels like you’re kinda walk into the mall and you’re sitting on a tube and then you’re landing. It’s like you’re actually going through a lie, and I I like what you’re saying, like, deliberately having a day to like, de stress, detoxify from what you just experienced is
Nick Urban [00:52:55]:
a good idea. Well, Michael, are there any other topics that we haven’t covered today that you think would be good to get in now.
Michael Brandt [00:53:02]:
Yeah. I think we covered a lot of ground, and I hope this was eliminating for a lot of people. Love to hear questions that people have. Happy to inner engage with people on Twitter, Instagram, whatnot. Love hearing from people. And I’ll put a link to all of the resources we discussed, including
Nick Urban [00:53:19]:
ketone IQ and HVMN m n in the show notes below. And I have these shots. I used to have a big jar jar, BHE big container of, like, 10 servings. But I believe you’re now available in some local grocers around the country.
Michael Brandt [00:53:35]:
Yeah. We launched recently nationwide with Sprouts, and you can find us in Sprouts in the refrigerated functional wellness shots section. And, yeah, we’re continuing to expand. And if if people have own retailers or gyms that that could be a good fit for this. Happy to chat. And or if you live near 1, like, yeah, go go pick us up. Spouses that the biggest account that we’re in right now, a lot more coming very soon. Can’t announce just yet. And then you can also find us on hvmn.com and Amazon as well.
Nick Urban [00:54:11]:
And can people just pick up a single shot if they wanna try it out once?
Michael Brandt [00:54:15]:
Yes. So in stores, you can it you can pick up a shot. Actually, the first shot is on us if UCS in stores to scan the QR code. There should be a QR code right next to the bottle or there’s one printed in fact on every bottle if you scan it. you’ll see very simple set of instructions. First shot is free on us in stores. And, yeah, that one is that one is in store only economics don’t quite make sense for us to do that through the mail, unfortunately. But anytime you see us in store, the first shot is free on us. Wow. That’s nice. Yeah. Enjoy. I I mean, we it’s us just putting our money where our mouth is. We think people will get a get a kick out of it, and we wanna
Nick Urban [00:54:51]:
cover the first shot. And I believe we also arranged for the code BHE. If people use that, then they can save on their order if they go through hvmn.com.
Michael Brandt [00:55:01]:
Yeah. Check that out. I think sharing over the link here, and let’s let’s drop that in the bio.
Nick Urban [00:55:07]:
Okay. Sounds good. Well, Michael, I have a couple more questions for you before we sign off today. Cool. The first one is if there was a burning of the books and all knowledge on earth was lost, You got to save the 3 the works of 3 teachers. Who would you choose and why?
Michael Brandt [00:55:23]:
So I I loved Sapiens, the the book by Yuval Harari. I thought that was just such a good distillation of, you know, where we’re at and how we got here. I just recommend that for everyone to check out. Another book I like, a lot just one of the ones I find myself referring back to, like, years years after reading it is born to run. It’s it’s a really good anthropology of how running has been part of our existence for so long. You know, humans uniquely can go further than any other species in Endurance. So, yeah, if you put a human next to a horse, for 24 hours, human can cover more distance. A horse needs to stop more. Human can just actually just go the whole time, just drink water along the way. because of the way that our physical body is built, because of the way that we interact with the world around us, like, with nutrition, like, we can sweat. We can drink. We can carry water or bipeds. Like, because of the with the human body is, like, we’re able to go further and So endurance hunting has been an advantage humans have always had. So I’ll born and run awesome book by myself turning that one quite often.
Nick Urban [00:56:44]:
I pushed back on that a little bit and said that humans are born to walk and to run occasionally.
Michael Brandt [00:56:50]:
That’s probably fair. It’s like because in that inside of that book, they talk about, like yeah. It’s like a slow jog BHE. It’s like, I don’t know if we’re if I don’t know if we’re be running 6 minute miles all the time, but I think, like, a 10, 12 minute mile. Like yeah. Something that’s, like, not super impactful. I think that’s a good clarification. So I love principles by Ray Dahlio. That’s more getting in, like, business. Again, I’m I I don’t know if any of these are gonna let us, like, reinvent the wheel or, like, reinvent the HTTP protocol stack, whatever. But as far as just, like, 3 of my favorite books that I think back too often. I really like principles by Ray Dahlio. He’s prolific investor, and I really like the way that He has broken down his system of thought into pieces, and he’s very just, like, aware hey. Like, hey. You have BHE. construct your world around you so that you’re stronger with people who counteract your biases and and call you out. He talks a lot about, like, deferring to the person on a and any given matter with the most believability. So it’s something I do a lot as as CEO. Like, I feel like my main job as CEO is not to decide things, but to decide who should decide things. And they’re like, okay. Well, our we have researched you guys a PhD, and ketone metabolism from Oxford. We have a product lead who has a master’s degree in chemical engineering. Like, I I’m generally not, like, out ranking them on decisions on what they’re doing, it’s more like, okay. Who do we pass the ball to? Like, who is the subject matter expert on this? Let’s make sure that that person has the loudest voice in the room. So principles by Ray Dollar had a lot of, like, just I I would say just, like, good rules, and I think he’s pretty good on, like, the meta point, which is, like, These are my rules. I suggest you have your own set of rules. Feel free to, you know, inherit the rules that I put down here, but also, like, more importantly, make a set of rules that works for you.
Nick Urban [00:58:43]:
Yeah. Well, I’ve got 2 more rapid fire questions for you. The very first is outside of ketones, what is one topic that you’re either researching or interested in? BHE running, barefoot living in general, barefoot lifting, bare just
Michael Brandt [00:59:00]:
BHE. Your foot is this incredible machine. And, you know, 20,000 nerve endings in each foot. It’s like your hand. It’s it’s completely incredible machine, and we wrap it up all day inside of shoes. And I’m just a massive fan of spending more time barefoot or if you’re wearing shoes, wear more, like, barefoot mimicking style of shoes. Try to spend time at the gym lifting or if you run, like, doing it in barefoot or minimal shoes. At least some of the time, you just get a lot better ground feel, proprioception, a lot better chain of motion up your entire kinetic chain because of the way that your foot is feeling the ground. lot of times when you have, like, weak arches, it’s like the the they try to sell you a shoe with, like, more arch support, which is, like, corrective BHE in a way it’s completely incorrect is, like, you should like, if you spend more time walking around barefoot, that’ll be painful, but, like, you’ll strengthen your arches over time. Obviously, there’s some delicacy to it. Like, if you need arch support, maybe you do need TBI, but, like, try to spend, you know, 5 minutes a day BHE, 15 minutes a day barefoot. Like, work on the muscles instead of just crutching them all of the time.
Nick Urban [01:00:07]:
Yeah. I was the king of Max Art support for a long time. didn’t realize that my shin splints and other things I was suffering with were actually a result of too much arch support. And these days, I spend the vast majority of my time barefoot or in minimalist shoes. And usually when I’m even lifting, I’ll do that barefoot.
Michael Brandt [01:00:26]:
Nice. So appreciate the choir there. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Exactly.
Nick Urban [01:00:30]:
And then finally, what is one thing that the HVMN tribe does not know about you? Oh, I think, like, this
Michael Brandt [01:00:38]:
special relationship I have with my daughter. She’s a year and a half old, and she’s it’s a very fun and it’s hard to even explain, which is maybe why it’s like it’s not like I’m trying to keep it a secret from people. It’s just, like, hard to explain. I think that there’s so much I think people who have kids probably understand in general, but, like, the the magical bond you see with with someone kinda, like, experiencing life, the way that you kind of remember that you did when you were that little, like, just the lights are starting to come on. They’re starting to figure things out. I think there’s something very pure to, like they’re just taking in raw source. and they’re experiencing it. And you’re kinda providing them with the map of, like, how to interpret the world, what constructs should they have, what’s safe, what’s not safe, what’s good, what’s not good. And then just realizing that all that stuff is stuff that you learned and, like, you might be right or wrong. You might have higher risk tolerance or lower risk tolerance or Like, you’re just giving them some map which, like, maybe kinda works for BHE, but I think it’s something very pure to being around a being that has very little construct or preconceived notion around about what’s going on in the world. It makes it’s made me very reflective of, like, what constructs do I choose to, like, continue to carry forward
Nick Urban [01:02:01]:
Yeah. Before culture and society has molded them. And when she is speaking, I’m sure she’ll say a bunch of things that challenge your BHE and hopefully cause you to go inward and determine where those perspectives are coming from and better yet to entertain the idea that maybe they have a BHE, more efficient, different way. Yeah. I look forward to it. I think that’ll be fun. Yeah. Well, Michael, any takeaways, any recaps you’d like to lay to leave the audience with today?
Michael Brandt [01:02:32]:
I thought this is great. I thought we had a couple of just really good really good nuggets inside of there. At least just the idea of, like, when you’re air traveling to really see it as a activity and, like, make sure you decamp properly from it, like, prepare for it, think about your nutrition, think about what you’re doing afterwards. Like, exercising, is that hitting a sauna? Like, what are you having? to mitigate any of the stress from air travel. I think that’s that’s a really good one. Just really think about that as a moment in your life to manage around and that you can manage around it. like the idea that we had around, like, the witch’s brew, like, being really thoughtful around, like, what is in your functional beverage at the beginning of the day, not being afraid experiment. Look at that as just like a work in progress that you’re all always iterating on that there exists some ideal combination of ingredients that you could have first in the day that, like, gives you the best possible day over the long run, and it’s good to it’s totally worth the worthwhile to keep iterating on that until you really get get it right and could, you know, keep iterating from there as well. Don’t be afraid afraid to try new things. Perfect. Well, it has been a pleasure hosting you today. Thanks for joining me and spending some time on the Mindbody Peak Performance podcast. Nick, this is awesome. Thanks so much for having me on and appreciate the amazing platform you built. I appreciate everyone listening in here today. It’s a lot of fun.
Nick Urban [01:03:53]:
Until next time, I’m Nick Urban here with Michael Brandt of Mind BHE peak performance signing out. Have a great week and be an outlier. I hope that this has been helpful for you. If you enjoyed it, subscribe and hit the thumbs up. I love knowing who’s in the 1% committed to reaching their full potential. Comment 1% below so that I know who you are. For all the resources and links, meet me on my website at mindbodypeak.com. I appreciate you and look forward to connecting with you.
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This Podcast Is Brought to You By
Nick Urban is a Biohacker, Data Scientist, Athlete, Founder of Outliyr, and the Host of the Mind Body Peak Performance Podcast. He is a Certified CHEK Practitioner, a Personal Trainer, and a Performance Health Coach. Nick is driven by curiosity which has led him to study ancient medical systems (Ayurveda, Traditional Chinese Medicine, Hermetic Principles, German New Medicine, etc), and modern science.
Music by Luke Hall
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